C3 Walkers

C3 has two main kinds of walkers. These are random walkers and destination walkers.

Random Walkers

Random walkers are spawned from many buildings in the game. Most of them have a cycle of four different walks, so can walk in either direction from their home building. Their path is determined by complex algorhythms in the game. So a random walker encountering a road intersection has to choose which direction to take, and this might be a different direction each time. Thus if you are relying on walkers to provide goods and services to your houses you need to eliminate intersections from their random walks. This is why square or (more commonly) rectangular building blocks are so popular and successful in C3.

Random walkers walk a certain number of tiles (which varies according to what building spawned them and also varies between the four different walks, generally one being longer than the other three). When they have reached the limit of their random walk, they then become destination walkers, and return by the shortest route to their home building.

Labor seekers who spawn from all buildings that require workers (except mission posts) follow the same rule. They are random walkers until they have walked their set number of squares, then become destination walkers, returning to their home building.

Random walk lengths vary between about 12 squares (missionaries , market sellers whose markets have no food/commodities) and 35+ squares (prefects), but most go around 23 squares on their shorter walks. When making a rectangular housing block it is useful to make the circumference just under double the lowest random walk distance (or shorter). This way when they become destination walkers, the quickest way home will be to complete the circuit of the block. I very frequently use 16x5 blocks (inside measurements).

Random walkers will not walk through gatehouses, and will only ever walk along a road (or through a granary) except that they will cross gardens, rubble, the pulley house of a warehouse or the forecourt of a fort, provided it leads to another road.

A random walker who becomes a destination walker but does not does not have a path its home building (perhaps because a tile of road has been deleted) will just disappear.

A note on granaries- granaries in fact have roads under them in a + shape. Thus they form an intersection with the road they are built on, with a further intersection at the centre tile of the granary. Granaries are not good news for random walkers, who can get caught up in them for what seems like hours, resulting in loss of control of your walkers. It is always a good idea to build granaries not in your housing block, but behind a gatehouse close to your housing block.

Destination Walkers

Destination walkers can be further divided into those that require a road connection to make a path, and those that do not.

Destination Walkers Requiring a Road Connection to Make a Path

Almost all random walkers become destination walkers after having walked their allotted number of squares (exception school children, who disappear into thin air at the end of their walk. Very occasionally engineers and tax collectors do this as well).

As well as random walkers returning home, all cartpushers are destination walkers from the moment they are spawned. So too are walkers spawned at entertainment schools, and market buyers (but not market sellers).

Destination walkers (including random walkers returning home) have their path mapped at the time they are spawned as destination walkers or at the time they become destination walkers, and do not deviate from this path. If their mapped path is blocked, they disappear. The road connection need not be maintained after the path has been set. If part of their road path is deleted they will just walk along the bare gound where the road formerly was.

Market buyers or cartpushers (including cartpushers from getting granaries) who reach their destination then become destination walkers once again for the return leg to their home building. If the road connection no longer exists at this time, they will teleport immediately to their home building. Much time can be saved with this completely legal trick. There are down sides though. If a docker does not have a road connection to its dock when returning, the docked ship will immediately leave. And if a getting granary cartpusher does not have a road connection after getting food from another granary, the food will be lost. Conversely, market buyers who teleport back to their home market due to a broken road connection take the food or goods they collected with them.

Destination walkers will make a path through gatehouses, gardens, rubble, the pulley house of a warehouse, or the forecourt of a fort provided these lead to a road that is connected by road to both the starting and finishing point, and provided also that this forms the shortest route to their destination. Destination walkers will also cut corners. This can be used to good effect by making a stepped road, destination walkers will treat it as diagonal and much time will be saved.

Destination Walkers Not Requiring a Road Connection to Make a Path

These are cartpushers from getting warehouses (but only when "getting goods" not when deliveriing), new immigrants, soldiers heading for their forts, (whether from a barracks or from being deployed) and land traders. None of these require a road connection to make a path, and if blocked will attempt to make a new path, but will disappear if unable to do so. Getting warehouse cartpushers and land traders will, however, use a road connection if one is available, even if this is further than an available non-road path.

Forced Walkers

Some consider forced walkers to be a third kind of walker, but really they are exactly the same as random walkers who later become destination walkers. The trick with them is controlling the destination square when they are returning to their home building. Forced walkers can be made to walk extroadinarily long distances, I believe up to 500 squares. Explaining exactly how they work is beyond the scope of this post, I would suggest do a search at C3 Heaven for Forced Walkers. Forced walkers are legal in C3 contests.

Multiple Cartpushers

Cartpushers (with the exception of dockers) who are walking somewhere generally do not disappear if their home building is deleted or destroyed. In the case of warehouses, a boolean flag in the game records whether the cartpusher is out or in. If, while the cartpusher is out, the warehouse is deleted and a new one built in its place (in exactly the same location), the flag on the new one will be set to in. If the warehouse is set to get something, a new cartpusher will spawn when the warehouse gets labor, and the flag will be again set to out. You can have an unlimited number of cartpushers owned by a single warehouse in this way, but they only last so long as no more than one is "in". As soon as one arrives at the warehouse while it is set to "in" that cartpusher is lost. Nonetheless it is a very useful exploit and regarded at CBC as completely fair play.

Note that rule 2.10 in CBC's C3 rules is incorrect. Multiple cartpushers do not necessarily last the rest of the game. They persist until such time as they arrive at their home building whilst the flag is set to "in".

The next one of these will concern market ladies, the bane of many a C3 novice.

Of all the workers that inhabit Caesar 3, market ladies are the most misunderstood. Most C3 players at some stage of their careers come to the conclusion that market ladies are buggy. One esteemed poster at the Tilted Mill forum even campaigned for C4 to include a statue of the market lady, in recognition of the headaches experienced by multitudes of players who were not able to gain an understanding of how the market lady works.

There are in fact two distinct kinds of market ladies, one of each works in each market. There is the buyer and the seller. Both look identical, they can be told by what they say when clicked on. Market buyers will either say that they are off to collect supplies, or if returning with supplies, will complain about their heavy baskets (and will have one or more children following them also carrying items). Market sellers when clicked on comment on the city in much the same way as do other walkers, or may inform you that they are going home because the market is out of food.

Market Sellers

Market sellers work in the same way as most other random walkers. The only difference is that their walk is much shorter, typically about 12 squares, if their market does not contain any food or commodities. Their walk is rather longer than average, perhaps 26 squares or so, provided their market does have food or commodities. If they run out after they have walked 12 squares or more up to their maximum, they will become destination walkers and return to market immediately.

Market sellers will distribute food and commodities to houses that require them. They will sell low level houses 4 times their number of occupants in units of food (1 cartload=100 units), higher level houses get more food but I’m not sure of the number offhand. They will also sell 8 units of pottery, 4 units of furniture and oil, 4 units of wine (up to large villa) or 8 units of wine (grand villa and above), provided the houses currently require each good or require it to evolve to the next level.

Market sellers can be forced walkers if the roads are located correctly.

Market Buyers

These are the cause of many the problems players have had with this game. Understand market buyers and you've just about got C3 down pat.

Those who suggest that Tilted Mill invented the pull system of goods distribution with COTN and C4 obviously have never heard of C3's market buyers. They work very much like markets in C4, which only have buyers, not sellers.

Market buyers will attempt to obtain food (in the order wheat, vegetables, fruit and meat/fish) provided that market’s buyer has passed a sufficient number of houses of any level (even small tents). Occasionally they are reluctant to appear at first after the market is built, especially if the buyer isn’t passing many houses. They will attempt to obtain all kinds of food, if they are available in granaries with a road connection. Market buyers will also attempt to obtain commodities (pottery, furniture, oil and wine) if either they or that market’s seller has passed any houses that are asking for those goods (a flag is set in the game when market ladies pass houses of certain levels). For example, as soon as a market’s buyer or seller passes a small casa, that market’s buyer will attempt to procure pottery, regardless of whether the small casa has bath house access or sufficient desirability to become large casa. However, market buyers will always attempt to get food, in the order shown above, if they have under 400 units of any type (600 for wheat) and they can reach a granary containing it. Only if they have over 400 of all available foods (600 wheat) or if no food is available from a road connected granary will they then attempt to procure other commodities that their houses require, and only when they have less than 50 units of a commodity in the market will they look for more.

It should be able to be seen that you do not want market buyers travelling long distances to get food or anything else. This is why non-connected housing blocks are the way to go in C3.

Market buyers can carry up to 800 units of wheat, or 600 units of other kinds of food, or 200 units of any one commodity. They cannot carry multiple commodities or foods at once.

Both market buyers and market sellers will distribute food and commodities to houses they pass that require them, provided the food and commodities are in the market. Market sellers returning with food or commodities cannot distribute the produce they are carrying, they can only distribute what is in the market.

Where players get into trouble is having market buyers traveling very long distances trying to get food, mostly wheat. This happens when a block is fed another (lower) kind of food and blocks are connected to other blocks by road. For this reason, it is a good rule not to connect blocks to other blocks by road. Having gatehouses in between makes no difference, market buyers walk straight through gatehouses.

The second mistake newer players make is trying to evolve houses too high. Unless you have a very steady and plentiful supply of pottery very close by, you are looking for trouble upgrading houses past small casa, unless you have a good reason for doing so. If evolving past small casa, realise that four 1x1 houses consume four times as much pottery and furniture as one 2x2, but house the same number of people. A block with 30 2x2 medium insulae (holding 2400 people fully occupied) will consume just over seven cartloads each of pottery and furniture per year. But if there are another 30 1x1’s in the block (holding a further 600), consumption is doubled. If your markets, granaries and warehouses are close enough together and your supplies are maintained, there is no reason a single market cannot keep up with this demand, provided market buyers are not running away long distances to get something. This is what brings housing blocks crashing down very quickly.

Production:

Farms

Wheat (Central or Desert provinces) 1 cartload per 0.625 months/ 19.2 cartloads per year.
Wheat (northern provinces), vegetables, fruit, meat (pigs) 1 cartload per 1.25 months/ 9,6 cartloads per year.

One central/desert wheat farm can feed 320 people, all other farms can feed 160. Because houses stockpile food farms will not feed this number of people right away, so if wanting to quickly feed all people you need to at least double the number of farms.

Olives and Vines: 1 cartload per 1.25 months / 9.6 cartloads per year.

Fishing Wharves:

The amount of fish a wharf will produce per year is 640/(distance in squares wharf to fishing point * 2 + 17). In other words, the closer the wharf is to the fishing point, the more fish is produced. Fish production can easily exceed central/desert wheat if the wharf is very close to the fishing point and a granary is also close to the wharf.

Raw Materials

Clay, iron, timber- 1 cartload per 1.25 months (9.6 cartloads per year)

Marble- 1 cartload per 2.5 months (4.8 cartloads per year)

Finished Products (all) 2.5 months per cartload (4.8 cartloads per year)

Consumption (1 cartload = 100 units):

Food:

0.5 units per person per month, rounded down. If a house requiring only 1 kind of food has more than 1 kind, only the highest food is consumed (wheat, then vegetables, then fruit, then meat/fish). Likewise for 2 or 3 kinds of food. Houses consuming 2 kinds of food consume ¼ unit per person of each of the highest 2 kinds in the house, rounded down. And houses requiring 3 kinds of food consume 1/6 unit per person of each of the 3 highest kinds in the house, rounded down.

Pottery, Furniture and Oil

2 units per house per month

Wine

2 units per house per month for houses requiring 1 type of wine, 4 units per house per month for houses requiring 2 types of wine.

- To have 2 types of wine you must have either 2 trade routes that sell wine open and wine set to importing, or one trade route that sells wine open and wine set to importing and at least 1 wine workshop in your city (wine industry may be shut down). You cannot sell wine if you have houses that require 2 types of wine (your houses will devolve due to having only 1 type of wine if you set wine to exporting).

I was attempting to navigate C3 over at Heaven. Is therre anywhere you can point us C3 noobs to some ideas of housing/building blocks? Twould be most helpful!

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Oh. My. God. She's found the keys to the medicine cabinet.

This thread seems like a good place to start. Joshofet's post (no 3) has all the links you could possibly want.

There is a search box at the bottom, from it you can find all kinds of information.

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Are you a victim? Of anything? Become a survivor by working for change. If anyone else suffers less than I did, then my pain has served a purpose and I hurt less.

Try it! http://c3modsquad.freeforums.org/

Help! Is there a mothball feature in C3? I started tutorials today and hope to make team audition in time. Reading GS links to Josofet's links is a basic building block like Caesar Alan the best way to go? Thanks.

You can turn an entire industry off in the Trade Advisor, but you cannot mothball individual buildings.

I use a rectangular building block 16 by 5 tiles (inside measurements). This allows pretty much all walkers to go all the way around.

I'm sure you won't go wrong with CA's blocks either.

I think you might need to forget about C4 when playing C3 because it is different in so many ways.

If you PM me I can assist you a little bit.

If you disconnect a building from the road network, but make sure a serviced road passes one tile from it, it will lose access to the labour pool, but will continue to have service coverage (engineer, prefect). Effectively it is mothballed, but since it can take quite a while before it loses its workers, it is not a very efficient way. It does serve other purposes, one of which will be visible in the main map ...

As GS said, in CIII you can switch off say all clay pits, but that only applies to industries, and for some (wharves, weapons?) it does not work IIRC. The other option is to set priorities for sections with the labour overseer. In later games, like Emperor, players were given more detailed options, but none of them is as elaborate as CIV.

My game is version 1. Need the patch (update) for v1.0.1.0 and links I found are no longer valid. Help? Thanks

Dalan I have c3up11.exe which is the US version patch and I expect the one you'd want. I should be able to locate your e-mail somewhere so I will send it.

These things are getting harder to find on the internet, and our links are no longer live. JuliaSet we perhaps should be putting them onto CBC as I have just searched around for a bit and can't find them.

I know Cesar20 has the French version. There is a UK version and a few others as well.

Anyone who has the C3 patches (particularly the executable versions) could you let us know and we'll arrange to put them up on CBC.

Have patches for US, PM me and I will send via email.

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Oh. My. God. She's found the keys to the medicine cabinet.

I've now found the UK, French, German, Italian and Spanish versions of the patch on some FTP site or other, so have downloaded them and will persuade the lovely JuliaSet to link 'em up in due course.

Edit: This zip contains all the known C3 patches. Just extract the one that corresponds to your game version. c3up11.exe = USA version, the others are called c3up11 (version).exe

Thank you for the patches. Any ideas on how to get hold of Philons tutorials? The two links available through Caesar Jan and Caesar Jay are not working. Wow you guys are good. I have been reading some old stuff that is great. GS, you have a 3x3 palace? Joshofet, Caesar Clifford, Philon, Goonsquad you guys/gals are pros!

2x2 palaces are my specialty. Download my entry in Palm Springs (CBC Contest No 77) and you'll see all the 2x2 luxury palaces your heart could desire. And about 3 million dn as well.

Caesar Philon's tutorials are still linked on Cesar20's site. They appear to be in English.

The links are not working.

Yes, I just changed the link to Cesar20's site. Those ones appear to work.

I just try and they work . They are both in english/french text

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HARD

Yes. I got them. Thank you very much. GS, very impressive. Such a stark contrast, tents and palaces on the desert.

The thing in Palm Springs was that only one reservoir was allowed. I think it was the only C3 contest in which I have reached the building limit.

Here is a little dissertation on the ratings system used in Caesar 3.

Prosperity

This is the rating that gives most players trouble. Prosperity can only change at the end of each year, with one exception. That exception is that if Caesar gives you top-up money, this costs you 3 prosperity instantly. In practice, it is fairly uncommon for this to happen in any year other than the first, when your prosperity is already 0 anyway, so cannot fall any lower.

Every city has a prosperity cap, which is the average prosperity score of every house in thne city. This is the maximum prosperity can reach at the current levels of housing. I won't list the ratings of each house, but they range from 5 for small tents up to 1750 for luxury palaces. This means that if you had nothing but small tents and luxury palaces, you could have 18 small tents for every luxury palace and still have 100 prosperity cap.

Prosperity can rise by no more than 10 per year, so the fastest 100 prosperity can be reached is after 10 years. The factors in the prosperity rise are-

Having a working hippodrome (1 point)
Having less than 5% unemployment (1 point)
Having more than 15% unemployment costs you a further 2 points.
Having at least 11% (1 in 9) of population as patricians (1 point)
Having at least 1 house of grand insulae or higher (1 point)
Having paid your workers wages 2 or more higher than Rome averaged over the full year (1 point). I think how it works is that Rome's wages as at the end of the year are used for the full year, but the wage paid is added each month.
Having less than 30% of population in tents or shacks (1 point).
Not being able to pay tribute to Rome also loses 1 point.

These points scores may not be perfectly accurate, but those are the factors. If you can satisfy all of the above, your prosperity should rise by 10 per year provided you have not reached your prosperity cap. If you have reached it, when checking prosperity in the ratinhgs advisor, the advice will be that the level of housing holds the rating back. Otherwise it will say your prosperity is rising.

Favor

You lose 1 favor per year if you are paying yourself less than your rank, 2 points if paying the correct salary for your rank, and 2 plus 1 for each level over your rank. This is only worked out on what your salary is at the turn of the year, what you pay yourself the other 11 months is irrelevent.

Other than this, favor can be increased by giving gifts (often not permitted in contests) and by satisfying Caesar's requests. Favor drops by 5 when you first are loaned money by Caesar, a further 10 if you remain in debt for a continuous period of 12 months, and it drops to 10 and an imperial invasion is spawned (to arrive in 12 months) if in debt continuously for 24 months, or continuously for 12 months having been in debt for over 12 months previously.

Favor drops if you fail to fill a request on time, and drops again if you do not fill the request in the 24 month extension.


Culture

Culture is calculated by the number of religious and educational buildings and theaters in your city proportionate to population. In the case of schools the number is worked out relative to number of children aged 0-12, and academies by the number aged 13-19. Yes, Caesar 3 does keep track of people's ages.

Perfect religion coverage gives 30 points of culture straight off. I could be out with the others, but I think schools are worth 20, theaters 25, libraries 15 and academies 10. You get a pro-rata score for less than perfect coverage. You can check with the religion, engtertainment and education advisors to asdcertain the level of your coverage, and the ratings advisor will tell you what you need to build to improve your culture rating. Culture buildings count with as few as 1 worker, but not with 0 workers.

Peace
You receive 2 points to your peace rating for the first 2 years, or the first two years after any buildings have been destroyed by invaders or rioters (some buildings, eg military buildings, prefectures, engineers and tents do not count). In the year of such damage you lose points off your peace rating (up to 12 points I think). Subsequently you receive 5 peace per year. Your peace rating increase is reduced by 1 if you have had any protesters in your city during that year. It takes a minimum of 22 years to reach 100 peace.

Libraries are 20 and schools are 15 but rest is right.

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Grand Champion C3 2001 World Cup. Novice Champion C3 2001 World Cup.Winner 7 Gold Medals C3 2001 World Cup.

Could you please "Sticky" this thread. Its useful for all newish C3 players in any contest.

Added Caesar Alan's Links from Polluteus Maximum thread so the info is all together


http://www.citybuildingcontests.net/...lan/index.html


Import limits: Cliff's post from Caesar Jan's site
http://www.citybuildingcontests.net/...2620#post22620

Bump and update:

Here is link for "Which way to Rome" - it has a couple of things missing from the pages saved from Caesar Alan's site where the links don't work any more. I think it is the same stuff as it would have been if Caesar Alan's page had been saved

http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Horizon/2974/

Specifically Tax explanation: (apologies if this already exists somewhere on here)

Has anyone ever checked The Wayback Machine for remnants of Caesar Alan's site?

I have found very old CBC pages on here.

http://www.archive.org/index.php

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I had seen a post at HeavenGames about Ceasar Alan's site being on Wayback Machine, I thougt I had coppied the post here, sorry.

__________________

Are you a victim? Of anything? Become a survivor by working for change. If anyone else suffers less than I did, then my pain has served a purpose and I hurt less.

Try it! http://c3modsquad.freeforums.org/

Trium's post on mood/sentiment at Heavengames

http://caesar3.heavengames.com/cgi-b...=2,6838,30,300

Here is a Link to the partial reconstruction of Caesar Alan's The Appian Way
as hosted here:
I think it was linked somewhere else and I forgot about it but here it is again:

http://www.citybuildingcontests.net/Caesar-Alan/

In case you're searching, here are some more mirrors of old sites, made by Grumpus:

Which Was to Rome?

Which Way to Thebes?

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We can work it out - Caesar IV team contest
http://www.villages-and-cities.de

Caesar Alan's site is here in archives :
http://web.archive.org/web/200308011.../strategy.html

Great work!!

JuliaSet this is more complete than the pages you saved recently, is there any way it can be moved to CBC before it is lost forever?

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Link to goonsquad's post on culture from Jungle Strut thread. Posted here to keep the information all together:

http://www.citybuildingcontests.net/...0695#post30695

What causes Entrance Flag to move. Also rule on building near flag.
(Added link so all useful detail can be found in this sticky thread)

Answer Here:
http://www.citybuildingcontests.net/...read.php?t=640